Transcript
WEBVTT
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Welcome back to the women's mental health podcast.
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I'm randy.
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I'm And I'm Jess.
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And we are two licensed psychotherapists, and this is a safe space where we talk about mental health, well being, and strategies for coping with life's challenges.
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And how all of this is normal, and you are not alone.
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Today, we're going to talk about a topic that's come up a lot for me lately.
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It's called body doubling and especially because it relates to ADHD.
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So if you have ever felt like you couldn't get started on a task, until somebody else was around, you've already experienced a little taste of what body doubling is.
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So find
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us and more information at womensmentalhealthpodcast.
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com.
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Have you ever had these thoughts?
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How does body doubling help women with ADHD?
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body doubling be done virtually?
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What tasks are best suited for body doubling?
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Do both people need to have ADHD for this to work?
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How do I find somebody that can help me body double if I live alone?
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And is it suitable for everybody with ADHD?
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And can it improve my emotional wellness?
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What should I look for in a good body double?
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That sounds funny.
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What should I look for in a good
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body double, right?
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Should I look just like me?
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Like you're, like, auditioning somebody for a role.
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And how do I introduce the concept of body doubling to someone who maybe doesn't have it?
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ADHD or isn't familiar with it.
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Hmm.
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And you are actually interviewing for a role.
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Because, we'll explain it a bit, but yeah, that's what you're doing.
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So let's first go through and define what body doubling is.
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So at its core, body doubling is the practice of working alongside another person to stay focused and productive.
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The idea isn't exactly to work on the same task either it's just having someone physically present or even virtually present to help you stay accountable and on track.
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And I was talking to Jess a little bit earlier and I was saying this is why those Twitch streaming rooms that are so popular, it's come to work with me or do homework with me or like a study room so people can do tasks together even virtually so they feel a little bit more at home.
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motivated.
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This is a great strategy for individuals with ADHD who struggle with starting or completing tasks because of challenges with executive function, focusing, motivation.
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These things all come into play.
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And that helps when you feel like you're being held responsible.
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Well, it's
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not
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even like
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starting it, it's staying In it.
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I know I can start it and then I'm like doo doo doo doo doo.
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Right.
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And next thing you know, I'm somewhere in the garden.
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So the idea of body doubling, it serves as like an anchor.
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It keeps you in place and it keeps that structure that you need for a sense of accountability.
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So like my daughter and I have done this.
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She's like, Mom, I'm struggling.
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Can I just come work with you?
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Sure.
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You know, I'll be sitting there working on the podcast and she's sitting on the floor doing her homework.
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We're not talking, we're not doing anything besides our own work.
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It's just our presence.
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Exactly.
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And I've even heard this in other terms of relationships too sometimes a partner can feel like, disconnected, and even if you don't enjoy what your partner enjoys, if you just go sit with them while they're doing it, and you're around it makes them feel Yeah.
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And connected.
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Yeah.
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Sometimes my husband will, sit on his computer and he'll play his game and I'll sit and do my thing next to him, even though we're not really talking or doing our things, but we're still together in the same room.
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So it's I guess the same thing.
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Yeah.
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So
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parallel.
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Yeah.
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Like parallel play.
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Yeah.
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With kids when you're younger.
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So where does this idea of body doubling come from?
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It's not a new concept.
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It's gotten really popular though, because of platforms like TikTok and YouTube.
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Just these young kids, young kids, these younger generations.
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are out there and they're learning about body doubling.
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the term body doubling specifically became more well known thanks to ADHD advocates, especially on social media and lots of generations sharing their experiences with their mental health and their tips online.
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So it's become more.
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Mainstream to talk about this currently exactly.
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This is what we did in college.
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That's how I study buddy.
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Yeah, a
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study buddy or an
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accountability partner.
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Like when you work out, it's the same thing for keeping on tasks or your mental health.
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Like just having somebody in your corner can be so powerful
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and a lot of women are already doing this because they don't realize they have ADHD and they need this.
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They're doing this because they've already gotten to this point where they have these social skills.
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And their social skills.
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My brain.
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It is offline today.
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It is off.
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Mine was offline last week and yours is offline.
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Oh my goodness So let's talk about how this affects specifically women and their mental health So, ADHD in women presents differently than it does in men or boys.
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Many women go undiagnosed until adulthood, like Jess and I.
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Yeah, I was, what, early 40s?
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And by the time that you realize you do have ADHD, you've internalized your feelings.
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You've created a lot of anxiety feeling about this.
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You feel a lot of shame or you feel inadequate because we have struggled to meet social expectations or we have struggled to fit.
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the norm.
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when you have ADHD, it leads to difficulties in managing responsibilities, maintaining focus.
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And we are very well known for procrastinating.
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And I always felt too guilty.
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Like, why couldn't I stay on task?
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Why would I always lose focus?
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I had a professor in grad school says that, you procrastinate because it's a form of opposition.
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And I was like, Oh, so I'm oppositional.
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Then great.
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No, no, no.
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I'm, I'm ADHD, which is why I waited the last damn minute to turn things in or do things.
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And it makes more sense now that I know.
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And even back then, I did body doubling.
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For things like folding my clothes.
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I talk on the phone while I clean my phone.
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I clean my phone.
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Folded my clothes.
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Oh my god.
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Today is just out of control.
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Sorry guys.
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I'm out of control today.
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Apparently, I'm not even gonna sure if I can edit any of this.
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Well, it's the same thing.
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When Jess and I get together, we're able to focus.
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And boom, boom, boom, put out all these tasks when we're not in the same room.
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We're like, Oh, yeah, we'll do that.
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Oh, yeah.
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Oh, yeah, we'll do that.
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And so it's just a way to be like that you feel like you're being held accountable.
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I feel like as women, we always get so overwhelmed with all of the things that we're juggling caregiving, work, personal goals, whatever habits, like we're trying to do it all.
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this is exactly where body doubling can be such a helpful tool.
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Yes.
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We're always talking about what tools can we use, what tools can we share with you guys?
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Because what it does is it provides external structure and accountability.
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And it really reduces a lot of that mental load that comes with managing all of these tasks solo.
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Even if you're on different tasks, you're not by yourself, you're going to keep working on what you're working on.
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And so it just is another tool to do.
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If you're curious about how to use body doubling, let's go ahead and let's share some practical tips.
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Yes.
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First, find somebody that you can body double with.
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This could be a friend, a co worker, a family member, or you can join an online co working group specifically for ADHD or productivity or studying.
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And then you're going to want to move into what, Jess?
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You want to set a very clear
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goal.
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So before you even start, agree on what you're going to be working on.
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The clearer the task, the more effective the session will be, and that way when somebody can, like with my daughter what you doing?
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What are you supposed to be doing?
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Well, even
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just and I were like, okay, we want to do we want to record two podcasts And then we want to work on our website and then we want to work on our social media and we're like, okay we give ourselves like an outline of the day that we've you know Carved out to spend time on this and then you know, somebody goes into the weeds.
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We're like, what are you doing?
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Come back to the task.
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So what's another thing we can use?
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using technology so like Zoom, Twitch, Focusmate, these are great virtual hangouts for body doubling.
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So even if you can't be physically in the same room, you can still see somebody and have each other, check in and keep on tasks and stay motivated.
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The other thing I
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want to talk about that was keeping our sessions short.
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You really, if focus is going to be the challenge, we have to do like short bursts, the chunking idea.
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don't do more than 25 minutes of focused work followed by a five minute break.
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Yeah, I have the Pomodoro method.
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Timer on my computer so I, I can set it, but I usually do like 15 minutes and then break 5 to 15 minutes and, go again and again if I'm having a hard time, staying on tasks.
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And I will say though, if you're using this method but you're all in a roll and you're like, no, I can keep going, keep going.
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Just keep going.
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And then stop when you're like, Oh, nope, there goes that.
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I lost that thought.
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And that way you can get up.
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I usually get up, walk around, do something else.
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And then I come back.
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another good thing is to experiment with different types of styles of this body doubling that might work for you.
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Maybe you like silent, maybe you like collaborative sessions, maybe you want to chat, maybe you want to listen to music, there's all sorts of different working styles.
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That can, people can benefit with doing this.
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That's true.
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Do you need to sit side by side with somebody?
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Do you need to have them across the room?
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Do you just need them to be somewhere in the room with you?
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Do
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you need them to check in with you?
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Do you need them, to discuss the plan with you or do you need them, just to Encourage you.
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Yeah, exactly.
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There's
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nothing wrong with saying you've got this.
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Let's tackle it.
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My daughter is always going, go mom, you got this mom.
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You've got this mom.
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She is such the great encourager.
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You've got this.
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Little cheerleader.
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She is.
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She is just my little cheerleader.
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Let's go through and answer some of our have you evers.
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Okay, so what is body doubling in the context of how it relates to ADHD?
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Body doubling is a strategy or a tool that has another person present to help a person with ADHD focus better and complete tasks.
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The body doubling serves as a subtle accountability partner, even if they aren't actively assisting with the task.
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If they're, they're not doing your homework, they're not helping you clean your room, they're doing a task with you, so that way you're both working on something.
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I guess it's also so you don't feel lonely.
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Yeah, like you're not missing something.
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You're not missing
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out.
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Same thing like whenever I clean the house like I never want to clean but if my partner steps in and helps me with it, it gets done.
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He's not helping you.
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He's participating.
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If he is also doing his part then it goes by so much faster and I don't feel the load on my shoulders like alone or any type of resentment.
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With that.
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So how does body doubling help women specifically with ADHD?
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For a lot of women who have ADHD, body doubling helps lower the feelings of overwhelm and procrastination, especially when we have tasks that we don't want to do, say, Randy's cleaning the house.
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The presence of having another person increases our dopamine levels in the brain and it aids to focus on productivity.
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So that's what it is.
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It's a dopamine hit, nice, we can have cheese and body doubling.
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Yeah, there goes our dopamine.
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Get some chocolate in there.
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We're all good.
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All right.
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So Randi, can body doubling be done virtually?
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Yes, it can be effective and done virtually through video calls or even having someone, working side by side on their own tasks, even on a Zoom call, or streaming live.
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And this really helps expands the access that we have of utilizing this coping mechanism, especially if we live in a rural area, or we, work from home and we need more accountability.
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I've even seen my daughter do her homework with somebody else who's doing their homework.
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via, they're on like, I don't know, Zoom or whatever platform they're on, or they're on a call.
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And I'm like, how are you guys both doing homework?
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You're on the phone?
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Oh, or you're on FaceTime or whatever it is.
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Yeah, FaceTime, that's the word I'm thinking.
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I'm like, what's that word called?
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What's that
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thingy?
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What
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is that thing we use all the time?
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Yeah.
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But yeah, they're just doing, both doing homework.
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And every once in a while, you'll hear somebody chat, and then they're still doing homework.
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It's just an interesting thing.
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Yeah, and there's whole communities like that too, so Discord too also has a whole voice chat community that you can use and different discords and they have streaming where you can get on video and stream and talk at the same time and so there's lots of free open platforms that you can do this in.
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Everybody in my house has discord but me.
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I'm the
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only one that like
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I just got
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it and I'm like, oh the
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whole new world I'm
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not doing i'm not doing it.
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All right, randy.
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So what tasks are best suited for body doubling?
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So it is really beneficial for tasks that might seem daunting or even boring things that you don't want to do at all, household chores, paperwork, your taxes, God,
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don't even talk about that.
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Even
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just, projects or papers you're working on.
